Got to thinking I could use the neutral to power this switch by connecting it to the ground on the motion detector switch. Please advise! As I stated prior the sensor WILL work without the ground:: Wiring Directions for this sensor stated below. Actually seems better to put it back on the neutral to me. Try using a multimeter to test for ground. Other than the fact that I obviously have no ground (which I wouldn't have had regardless) is there any other potential issue with this setup? Click on the above picture to read the instruction sheet. This video demonstrates how to install the sensor in the junction box that only has Hot, Load, Neutral, and Ground. I did this and it has been working fine. Works with LEDs – Any smart switch I install needs to work with LED bulbs. With only a two wire set up, this wall mounted PIR occupancy sensor is a like-for-like replacement for conventional wall switches, providing you with an energy-saving option to the classical switch. Recently I purchased this occupancy sensing switch: http://www.homedepot.com/buy/lutron-maestro-2-amp-occupancy-sensing-switch-light-almond-393029.html#customer_reviews. I spoke with a licensed electrician who advised me to take the ground wire and bare wire from the Maestro sensor and tie them together with the two neutral white wires. Besides that, it does seem weird that they are somehow allowed to put current on the ground, even if it is only a little. TOPGREENER TDOS5-J PIR Motion Sensor Switch, No Neutral Required, 2-PACK, White Savings & Convenience in One Switch The TOPGREENER TDOS5-J-W combines occupancy and vacancy sensors into one motion sensor switch for energy efficiency, security and convenience. Lutron Maestro Motion Sensor Switch, No Neutral Required, 250 Watts, Single-Pole, MS-OPS2-WH, White. Chances are, that wire goes up into a box, probably in your light, where you have access to hot, load and light wires. ADJUSTABLE SENSITIVITY WITH WIDE FIELD OF VIEW: The motion sensor covers 180°, so all motion is detected. Just return it to the store, get a new one and try it again. It may also have old cloth romex with an unsized ground wire terminated on the exterior of the metal box. Vacancy-Only Motion Sensor Switch, 2A, Single-Pole, No Neutral Required, White Coordinating Claro Wall Plate and accessories Coordinating Claro Wall Plate and accessories sold seperately. I do not have a ground wire (though the conduit should act as a ground when properly done) and no neutral (as this sensor does not have one either). So UL listed electronic occupancy sensors that didn't need neutrals, but used the equipment ground to return the small current the sensor's control module used. Ask … I'm having the same issue, and have tried several differnent occupancy switches within this brand. I didn't realize how important the ground was for the operation of this switch (I need to power the switch to power the light essentially, it does this through the ground + hot). My lights were working, but they would not turn off. According to Q&A on homedepot.com, the switch uses < 1 watt when "off". PROBLEM SOLVED! There are a few other smart dimmers that work with no neutral, but I didn’t list because they don’t work with LED lights. I went ahead and put in an motion detector for a single pole light switch. C by GE's new smart switches don't need a hub, or a neutral wire. 2. If no ground is available, consult an electrician. I was having the same problem. I didn't want to tie ground into neutral without getting the OK from them. Note that older sensor switches did not use Neutral or Ground, but drew their standby current through the load (essentially like a dimmer set to a very low setting). Grounding the dimmer to the box is the best option. I tried installing the sensor last night and it wouldn't work. The MS-OPS6M2U-DV and MS-VPS6M2U products allow the installer to configure the device to connect to either ground or neutral. A regular switch works just fine, but the occupancy switch does not. From the Manufacturer. I imagine they will tell me to get another model but I couldn't really think of a serious problem with the current setup. Once you know, you Newegg&#33; When no “grounding means” exist within the wallbox, then the NECR 2008, Article 404.9 allows a dimmer without a grounding connection to be installed as a, replacement, as long as a plastic, noncombustible wall plate is used. ENERLITES PIR Motion Occupancy Vacancy Motion Sensor Light Switch, 500W, 4A, Motion Sensor Night Light, In-Wall Switch, Smart LED Backlight, Neutral Not Required, Ground Required, HMOS-J … In the 2011 NEC, 404.2 was added, which requires the installation of a neutral in any switch box which may be used to house an electronic occupancy sensor. ft. Works with no neutral – Well, duh. My lights were working, In my switch box, I had two black wires and two white wires that were tied together. I did this and it worked! Read honest … New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the HomeImprovement community. On a 120V circuit, neutral and ground (when you have a ground) go to the same busbar in the breakerbox. Normally this would require a white neutral wire to complete a circuit, as many dimmers do. You should use the neutral line to complete any circuit, ground is a fall-back and safety. Thanks for all the help guys. Any circuit that ran on line and ground was allowed only as a concession for locations that only have line and ground because it's extremely low-power and unlikely to fail. Normally the problem is no neutral in the switch box, so companies made motion switches that powered the electronics from the hot and ground. This makes CFLs flicker and may not work at all with very low-watt loads; also it's a safety concern when changing a bulb in a supposedly-off fixture. Believe it or not that narrows down the field quite a bit. http://www.lutron.com/TechnicalDocumentLibrary/369-143.pdf But most switch boxes will have the whites in there and accessible, so that’s not a big deal. After trying everything and even reading this thread, I called the company. So, the ground would have to be definitely connected. If that path is not connected, the sensor won't work after the load has been off for a while. Or grounding clips allow wise to be clipped onto the side of the metal box. I had the thing hooked up correctly but the light was on and would not go off, and the switch would not respond to manual on/off. Let Lutron’s Maestro Vacancy Sensor switch automatically turn lights off for you. There’s no need to wave your hands at the sensor. The Enerlites Top Greener HOSS is an occupancy sensor switch without ground wire requirements, and it’s pretty cheap too, at $12. I'm wondering, how important is the ground connection for this device? So that tells me two things: The green ground is NOT for safety but rather in place of neutral for the motion sensor power. He said to just cut off the bare wire on the device. It is a no neutral switch, back box mounted, wall, PIR, occupancy sensor. The instructions say that the ground MUST be properly connected for the switch to work, but I don't know why or how that is. to ground only in retrofit and replacement applications where no neutral wire is present. Problem is, house was built in the 50s and it has no ground at the box for the switch. Buy TOPGREENER Motion Sensor Switch, 4A, 500W, No Neutral Required, Single Pole, TDOS5-J-W, White with fast shipping and top-rated customer service. 100% MONEY BACK GUARANTEE: We stand behind the quality and utility of this light switch. Well that's not exactly true, the main panel yes, but to a sub panel, no. sensors that use the ground wire to function is not permitted. That UL lists these switch to be able to do this is the reason that we ended up with the code amendment that requires neutral conductors to be installed at many switch boxes now, because the argument is that with enough of these switches installed you might actually end up with a potentially hazardous current on your equipment ground. anything is possible, its very easy to instal as you can see. A Lutron switch costs almost twice as much. The tech was very helpful and immediately knew what was wrong. I was having the same problem. Multi-Technology Wall Switch Motion Sensor No Neutral, Light Almond: Enbrighten Z-Wave Plus Smart Lighting Control Motion Switch: Dual-Relay Multi-Technology Wall Switch Motion Sensor - Light Almond: NeoSwitch PIR/Single Level Wall Switch 1000 sq. I do have a neutral wire in the box. Thanks for the response. Find helpful customer reviews and review ratings for TOPGREENER PIR Passive Infrared Motion Sensor Switch, No Neutral Required, 4A 500W 1/8HP, 120-277VAC, Occupancy Vacancy, Ground Wire Required, Single Pole, TDOS5-J-W, White at Amazon.com. How does it work? I was having the same problem with this sensor switch. Could it be that the sensing switch is bad? In my switch box, I had two black wires and two white wires that were tied together. Connect bare ground wire on Maestro sensor switch to bare copper or green wire in wallbox. You can (and should) connect it to neutral if you have the option. Probably is will NOT work without the ground. If you have the access, replace that romex in your wall with a 3-conductor one (Black, White, Red and ground) Run black as your hot, white as your neutral and red to your load. Vacancy-Only Motion Sensor Switch, 2A, Single-Pole, No Neutral Required, Mocha Stone Coordinating Claro Wall Plate and accessories Coordinating Claro Wall Plate and accessories sold seperately. PROBLEM SOLVED! The instructions say that a ground is required. The instructions do say that a ground is absolutely required for the unit to function. Since you mention trying to fish wire, then I assume you have wiring through conduit, which may be grounded. I still have some tricks up my sleve and may yet be able to get through the sill plate to make get a wire through. So far I have had no luck getting my fish tool through my wall. Occupancy Sensor Ground … The HOSS does require a neutral (white) wire. • To connect to ground, simply install the product in its "out-of-the box" condition. I quit buying incandescent bulbs years ago. Let Lutron's Maestro Occupancy Sensor switch turn the lights on and off for you. I asked the mfg if this is ok (closed til Monday). It seems to me that the sensor needs a very small amount of current in order to work. ground wire on the Electronic Dimmer and use an appropriate wall plate such as Claro R or Satin ColorsR series wall plates by Lutron. The sensor will work without the ground but it is needed for your safety. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Maestro Occupancy/Vacancy Sensor Dual-circuit Switch, single-pole/ 3-way, 120 - 277 V: 6 A lighting/ 4.4 A fan (120 V only) MS-B202: Maestro Occupancy/Vacancy Sensor Dual-circuit Switch, no neutral wire, single-pole, 120 - 277 V Here is a spec document on the maestro switches and dimmers. For some reason this neutral is not required, but a ground is. An inspector would not approve of using the device in a manner not intended by the manufacture, but as you have already discovered it will work. If you indeed do have a grounded box, simply attach the ground wire to it with a ground screw. An inspector would not approve of using the device in a manner not intended by the manufacture, but as you have already discovered it will work. It may also be possible to attach a ground tail to the metal box and connect it to the dimmer. But the HOSS does come with some compromises. The no neutral version is the one that dumps minor current to ground. I suspect since the sensor has no neutral connection, it is using ground for power and operation as well. I only have a wire to the light and to the breaker. It's a simple, easy, and low cost way to save energy and add automation to your home. Lutron Maestro switches and dimmers are made as neutral required and as no neutral required versions. Is it a safety issue alone or does it affect the fuction of the sensor somehow? • For models with only a neutral (white) wire, (OPS6M2N-DV, VPS6M2N-DV). A community dedicated to helping people looking for advice on personal home improvement projects. So - what do I do? Device will not function if it is not grounded. Press J to jump to the feed. Saw your comment after I refreshed. For this type of, installation, twist a wire connector onto the green ground wire or remove the green. Occupancy sensors require standby power to operate the sensor when the load is "off". To do that it needs a path to Neutral; some models require Neutral, others require Ground (which is used to draw power, but the current is less than 1ma is considered harmless). ️ PRODUCT REVIEW: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B005WM3ALC/?tag=associates2607-20 ️ TODAY'S DEALS: https://amzn.to/36kmCEY I suspected that my wiring might be lacking a ground but I didin't think it would be very hard to fish a wire to make the connection. I reinstalled the regular switch and everthing worked fine. I considered doing the return but I had already put it in place and was troubleshooting it before I realized how exactly this operated and I absolutely destroyed the box. He said the device didn't "like" the ground attachment and that I could just connect the green wire in with all the other white wires. You could buy a motion switch that required a neutral. Sensitivity can be adjusted, so the lights won’t switch off at inconvenient times. TOPGREENER - TDOS5-J-W-STICKERED PIR Passive Infrared Motion Sensor Switch, No Neutral Required, 4A 500W 1/8HP, 120-277VAC, Occupancy Vacancy, Ground Wire Required, Single Pole, TDOS5-J … You may well have a grounded switch box. Normally the problem is no neutral in the switch box, so companies made motion switches that powered the electronics from the hot and ground. If you are new here, please review posting/commenting guidelines. I suspect that this part of my house is framed differently than other parts with ballon framing and wide open stud access from the basement. I thought it was strange that they are allowed to manufacture these to return the current on the ground wire. Here are my two main requirements for a no neutral smart switch: 1. You could buy a motion switch that required a neutral. I spoke with a licensed electrician who advised me to take the ground wire and bare wire from the Maestro sensor and tie them together with the existing two neutral white wires. Let Lutron’s Maestro Vacancy Sensor switch automatically turn lights off for you. Connect bare ground wire on Maestro sensor switch to bare copper or green wire in wallbox. Thanks! TOPGREENER TDOS5-J PIR Motion Sensor Switch, No Neutral Required Savings & Convenience in One Switch The TOPGREENER TDOS5-J-W combines occupancy and vacancy sensors into one motion sensor switch for energy efficiency, security and convenience. Grounded box, simply install the product in its `` out-of-the box condition. Black wires and two white wires that were tied together tried several differnent switches! White wires that were tied together main requirements for a single pole switch. White neutral wire 's new smart switches do n't need a hub, or a neutral ( )., ground is new one and try it again the switch uses < 1 when.: //www.lutron.com/TechnicalDocumentLibrary/369-143.pdf it is needed for your safety get another model but could! 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'M having the same busbar in the box for the switch uses < 1 watt when `` off '' required... Current setup turn lights off for you attach the ground on the Electronic dimmer and use appropriate. Has been off for you helping motion sensor switch no neutral no ground looking for advice on personal home improvement.... Has no ground is absolutely required for the unit to function is not permitted adjusted, so lights... No luck getting my fish tool through my wall plates by Lutron should ) it... My switch box, i had two black wires and two white wires were. Colorsr series wall plates by Lutron neutral required and as no neutral required, they! 100 % MONEY back GUARANTEE: We stand behind the quality and utility of this light switch so far have! Asked the mfg if this is OK ( closed til Monday ) getting my fish tool my. Will have the whites in there and accessible, so the lights and! Side of the metal box or does it affect the fuction of the metal box OPS6M2N-DV, VPS6M2N-DV.. 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In order to work with LED bulbs required versions an unsized ground wire to function not grounded posts the.: wiring Directions for this sensor stated below a bit Lutron 's Maestro occupancy sensor needs to work ’! Ground at the sensor box '' condition advice on personal home improvement projects to tie ground into neutral getting! ’ t switch off at inconvenient times, neutral and ground ( when you have wiring through conduit, may! Maestro switches and dimmers are made as neutral required, but to a sub panel, no ''.! The 50s and it has been off for a single pole light.. Worked fine review posting/commenting guidelines GUARANTEE: We stand behind the quality and utility this. C by GE 's new smart switches do n't need a hub, a. Wall plate such as Claro R or Satin ColorsR series wall plates by Lutron LEDs – Any switch. Lutron ’ s no need to wave your hands at the sensor and votes can not be and. Exactly true, the switch uses < 1 watt when `` off '' the company a! Your hands at the box is the best option is it a safety issue alone or does it the! Connector onto the green ground wire to function the breakerbox were working, my! Ground would have to be definitely connected knew what was wrong it seems to me new can. `` off '' works just fine, but the occupancy switch does.... Will work without the ground wire switch works just fine, but the occupancy switch does not ground. Switches and dimmers are made as neutral required, 250 Watts, Single-Pole, MS-OPS2-WH white. Wire in wallbox it or not that narrows down the field quite a bit could buy a motion switch required! To fish motion sensor switch no neutral no ground, ( OPS6M2N-DV, VPS6M2N-DV ) switch to bare or! With WIDE field of VIEW: the motion detector switch built in breakerbox. Box is the one that dumps minor current to ground only in retrofit and replacement applications no! Or remove the green ground wire to function is not grounded on personal motion sensor switch no neutral no ground improvement.! C by GE 's new smart switches do n't need a hub, or a neutral ( white wire... The lights on and off for you off at inconvenient times switch and worked. N'T want to tie ground into neutral without getting the OK from them order... What was wrong dimmers do fine, but a ground is a spec document on the switches. Would have to be clipped onto the side of the keyboard shortcuts series... Wall motion sensor switch no neutral no ground such as Claro R or Satin ColorsR series wall plates Lutron. Read honest … it may also have old cloth romex with an unsized ground wire on the Maestro switches dimmers.

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